35. JOSH AXE: The Hidden Root of Healing

Episode Transcript

Note: Transcript is AI-generated and may contain errors. Please refer to the episode audio or video for exact quotes.

[00:00:00] Josh: Your body works on a spectrum in terms of it being alert and trying to fight for itself or it healing. So you’ve kind of healing and growth and regeneration on one side of the spectrum and you have protection and fear on the completely other side.

[00:00:15] Michael: I am Michael Hyatt

[00:00:16] Megan: and I’m Megan Hyatt Miller

[00:00:17] Michael: and you’re listening to the double wind show.

[00:00:19] Megan: And we are so excited to share with you our recent conversation with Dr. Josh Axe.

[00:00:25] Michael: Yeah, so Josh has been a friend of mine for, I don’t know, a number of years, but he’s the founder of DrAxe. com, one of the world’s leading health websites. He’s the co founder of Ancient Nutrition, a supplement company focused on traditional healing principles.

[00:00:38] He’s the best selling author of several books, including Keto Diet, Ancient Remedies. And his most recent, Think This, Not That. But he holds certifications as a doctor of natural medicine. He’s a chiropractor, a clinical nutritionist. He’s been featured on a number of major media outlets, including the Dr.

[00:00:56] Oz Show, Fox News, and Good Morning America. But he’s a passionate [00:01:00] advocate for holistic health. And he has really a broad knowledge Of all the different kinds of health practices. And he’s been an enormous personal resource to me. And we’re excited to share this conversation with Dr. Josh Axe,

[00:01:16] Megan: Josh, welcome to the show,

[00:01:18] Josh: Megan, Michael. Thanks for having me.

[00:01:20] Megan: We are so excited. Oh my gosh. We have so many things to talk about. We actually were cut off by our team that said, you know, y’all have to stop talking. And. Save it for the podcast. It

[00:01:30] Michael: feels like they say that every time.

[00:01:31] Megan: Especially when we get to have somebody in person with us today.

[00:01:33] We’re so happy that you live nearby. So you could be here. We just have a million things to talk about. I was walking

[00:01:37] Josh: down the streets of Franklin, ran into Michael. We came in

[00:01:39] Megan: together. He was like, come on, let’s just, let’s go have a podcast. Yeah.

[00:01:43] Michael: So catch us up. I recorded a podcast with you where I was on your show.

[00:01:48] What was that? Maybe. Six months ago. Yeah.

[00:01:50] Josh: About

[00:01:50] Michael: nine. Yeah. So what’s happened since then? What have you been doing the last six months?

[00:01:55] Josh: Well, I, I, a lot. Yeah. I launched a couple of new businesses, which I’m super excited about. [00:02:00] Uh, one is a virtual medical clinic. It’s a focusing on nutrition and supplementation and blood work.

[00:02:07] And so focusing on that, that’s called the health Institute. And then actually about to open up. Functional medicine clinic here in Nashville in September, that’s going to be called the longevity club and clinic. And so we’re really focused on doing peptides and photo biomodulation and hyperbaric chamber and IVs and some, a lot of advanced nutrition.

[00:02:23] Can I give you my credit

[00:02:24] Michael: card

[00:02:24] Josh: today? So yeah, focusing on that and then writing a new book on longevity. What I’m excited about. And uh, You know, life wise, just really trying to cherish time with our girls, got a one year old and four year old, and you’re going on a trip to Park City here next week, and so just really focusing on I mean, I read this book recently, it was so good, uh, Die With Zero.

[00:02:44] Oh yeah. There are some principles, as a Christian, I don’t probably totally align with some of the mindset, but some of the mindset of really focusing on making memories and experiences. And so Chelsea and I are really intentional right now about trying to do that with the book,

[00:02:56] Michael: but I’ve heard really good things about it.

[00:02:59] This is going to be fun [00:03:00] guys. Longevity is kind of one of those topics that for us in health. is a big focus of interest. Part of it’s come out of our own experience, you know, our own health challenges, but, uh, I’m going to a peptide mastermind, and I’m the only non doctor there, in two weeks.

[00:03:17] Megan: Will you come back as a doctor?

[00:03:18] Wow.

[00:03:18] Michael: I did this two years ago, and I only understood about 35 percent of it, but it still helped me immeasurably. Mm hmm. And so this is all about peptides, this particular one. So, I want to talk about several of your books, and I thought where we’d start is the keto diet. Like, I was big into it five or six years ago and it was enormously helpful in terms of losing weight.

[00:03:40] But frankly, I didn’t have that much weight to lose. But what it was helpful for more than anything was just my mental acuity and my sense of energy. Yeah. I do kind of a Mediterranean diet and eat pretty low carb all the time. What is the state of the industry? I had checks

[00:03:54] Megan: for breakfast this morning. So if you’re thinking to yourself.

[00:03:57] Maybe this isn’t the show for me. You’re in good company. [00:04:00] It’s okay. You’re going to get some great tips. I mean, I know I did. I did have a protein drink with it. Does that help?

[00:04:06] Josh: It helps. It absolutely helps. So here’s my philosophy on the keto diet. And it’s always been this way. Actually I wasn’t intent on writing a book on the keto diet.

[00:04:14] I had a publisher tell me, Hey, we really need somebody to write a book on the keto diet. Would you do it? And I said, listen, my philosophy is. It’s not for everybody. It’s for a very specific set of group of people for a specific set of time. And so, I’m not one of those people thinking everybody should be on keto.

[00:04:28] My dietary philosophy is much more very personalized. I think everybody, I mean, between the three of us, all of us should have a variation to our diet based on our own individual needs. And this goes back to a lot of my study of Chinese medicine in terms of very, creating a customized plan for everybody.

[00:04:44] Based on the research, the people that do the best with the keto diet are people who have neurodegenerative illness. Typically everything from brain cancer. In fact, the best research is on glioblastoma. So certain types of brain cancer, epileptic seizures in children. If somebody does want [00:05:00] to lose weight, I think it’s a great diet to start off and do for maybe three months, but then.

[00:05:04] Start transitioning into more of a low carb Mediterranean diet. I actually think is a much better option There’s a term because what happens a lot of people don’t realize this if you’re on keto Different organs have to deal with different macronutrients. So for instance your pancreas deals with carbs right insulin pancreas So that’s the organ that takes the most stress.

[00:05:23] That’s why I was really working hard with

[00:05:25] Megan: my checks this morning.

[00:05:26] Josh: Exactly. Yeah. So, so, and then your liver and gallbladder and lymphatic system have to deal the most with fat. And then we know your stomach and your kidneys, a little bit, your liver all deal with protein. So if you’re on a keto diet and doing, let’s say 70 plus percent fat every day, If you don’t have a really robust and healthy liver, it’s going to be too hard on your liver and over time actually could cause heart issues.

[00:05:50] Now, it typically wouldn’t happen in the short term, but if somebody does it for a long period of time, keto, that much amount of fat can start to overburden their liver. So that’s why I don’t recommend it for [00:06:00] long periods. Unless Someone has brain cancer and in that case there’s studies showing this it’s your best chance of survival long

[00:06:06] Megan: term.

[00:06:06] Yeah, that’s fascinating. I listened to a podcast recently, I think it was on, um, diary of a CEO EO, which I love. Yeah. One of my favorite podcasts was Steven Bartlett and he had an expert on, who was a cancer researcher, and he was talking about the value of keto for cancer itself.

[00:06:23] Josh: Yeah.

[00:06:23] Megan: And I had not kind of heard it in that context.

[00:06:25] Most of my exposure to it was more like in a weight loss context, and I, I thought to myself immediately. God forbid I ever end up with cancer. That would be my go to, you know, it was just so compelling. The research that he presented.

[00:06:39] Josh: Yeah.

[00:06:39] Megan: Um, but he said the same thing. He said like, it’s not for everyone, for everything, but there is a real targeted value to it, particularly with the brain cancers.

[00:06:46] Michael: Yeah. I had a followup question. I did carnivore for one month last year. I was basically just trying to eliminate everything, you know, but the basics, but I know there are people that are into this. For the long haul.

[00:06:58] Josh: Yeah.

[00:06:59] Michael: [00:07:00] What do you think of that?

[00:07:00] Josh: So I’m actually going out, I’m doing an interview, uh, a podcast with Michaela Peterson and Jordan Peterson’s daughter here this month.

[00:07:07] And she’s been carnivore for a pretty long time. Yeah. Almost 10 years. It saves your life basically. Yeah, exactly. So she had something called SERS. Basically it’s a syndrome where you have massive inflammation reactions to anything. What typically causes this is if somebody has a real imbalance in their gut microbiome and they have overgrowth of certain types of bad bacteria, mold, fungus, those sorts of issues, when they eat.

[00:07:28] Meat meat doesn’t ferment in the same way carbohydrates do. And so what they will tend to do is their body won’t have these intense immune reactions if you’re on carnivore. So there are a group of people with severe autoimmune illness and inflammatory conditions that if they do carnivore, it’s like a miracle for them.

[00:07:45] However, it’s not the ideal diet to do long term. It’s similar to keto in this way to where if you’re on carnivore longterm, you are. Robbing your body typically of minerals. I had a PhD on recently. His name is James D. Nicolantonio And he talked about his [00:08:00] research on this He’s a researcher and he said I found that if somebody stays on carnivore too long, it starts to pull minerals from their bones So it starts to pull calcium phosphorus and it’ll cause Osteoporosis osteopenia and so I do think for people with mold People with major autoimmune reactions going carnivore for a period of time can be a pretty incredible diet and super healing, especially if you’re doing it the right way.

[00:08:22] 100 percent grass fed meat, wild salmon, those sort of things. I think that you can do it for a period of time and it’s sort of a reset. However, you do have to go through a period of trying to rebuild back up the gut microbiome to where it can handle vegetables. It can handle fruits. I mean. Somebody’s going to be healthier that way long term.

[00:08:41] But it’s a good intermediary to do as a treatment.

[00:08:43] Michael: What I hear you also saying is that long term for most people, Mediterranean diet, low carb. Yes.

[00:08:49] Josh: By the way, we use the term low carb, but I think it’s normal carb. You know, it’s probably what we’re meant to be eating, but for us, it probably is lower carb because the standard American diet [00:09:00] is put in our brains.

[00:09:01] Like, you know, the bottom of this food pyramid for years is like grains, grains, grains, grains, grains. And that’s what we subsidize. That’s what we grew. It was in all of our food. But, you know, if I’m looking at sort of like an ancient diet based on what’s growing. Like the healthiest diet tends to be one of plants that just they’re known as perennials.

[00:09:17] They just grow naturally every year, like berry bushes, apple trees, like these things are just growing. Like we have to plant fields of wheat, fields of grain. So imagine even going back to the Garden of Eden. I don’t know that there were fields of wheat, but there were fruit trees, there were berry bushes, there were things growing in the ground.

[00:09:32] Eating a diet that’s tended to be higher in vegetables and fruits and wild meat. Is typically going to be the healthiest. And that generally is low carb. It’s considered more Mediterranean and there are foods. I’m writing a book right now with Jordan Rubin that’ll release this year. It’s called the Biblio diet.

[00:09:46] It’s eating by the book. It’s a diet based on the Bible. Great title. And so we’re going through, okay, what does the Bible really say about food nutrition? And one of the things you’ll see there is, is like the Bible is constantly talking about lamb and beef. It’s talking [00:10:00] about fermented dairy. It’s talking about a lot about pomegranates and figs and extra virgin olive oil.

[00:10:06] And there are bread, when it does talk about bread, we know that that was a sourdough, a sprouted grain, you know, whole fermented bread.

[00:10:12] Michael: And different grain than we have today. Radically

[00:10:15] Josh: different, radically different. Yeah, they tended to do a, you know, a multi grain bread probably that included wheat, rye, and barley, and then they sprouted it and fermented it.

[00:10:23] I mean, so we’re talking about a bread that is very bioavailable. You’re absorbing every last thing in it. Today, when you don’t sprout or ferment something, you’re essentially digesting none of it. In fact, You’re probably losing nutrients because When you don’t sprout it, you have this stuff called phytic acid in it, which is actually pulling minerals out of your own body.

[00:10:41] So

[00:10:41] Megan: it’s net negative.

[00:10:42] Josh: It’s not negative. Yeah. So it’s very different.

[00:10:44] Megan: Wow. Okay. I’ve about 15 ways my brain wants to go right now. I’m going to try to pick only one. Let’s talk about the microbiome because I feel like for a lot of people, this is. challenging to cultivate and really even understand there are [00:11:00] so many products that are available.

[00:11:01] You know, I think one of the things that leads I find confusing is that like I go to my local Whole Foods or I am online or something and I see All of these products that purport to solve my problem. But what do I really need if I want to have a great healthy microbiome that is going to contribute to my long term health span, that’s going to help my immune function.

[00:11:26] I have Crohn’s disease. So like, you know, I, I fortunately have, have done really well with that and have been remission without medicine for a long, long time. But to deal with inflammation, what do I need to do? For my microbiome,

[00:11:39] Josh: I’m gonna go kind of high level and then make it really simple. Okay, great.

[00:11:42] So the first thing is the way that we view health in the West is very different than health in the east. So health in the east, there’s actually something longevity in ancient Chinese medicine in Ayurveda and just the ancient world. They said there’s actually a quote and it says, cherish the three treasures.

[00:11:56] These are weird words for us, but it’s she chi and Jing, and [00:12:00] that’s. body, mind, and spirit. So we don’t really focus on our mind and our spiritual health when it comes to longevity. But what’s interesting is there’s a Harvard study. It’s the longest study on health. It’s 90 years old now. And it says the number one determining factor of longevity for you is having strong relationships.

[00:12:16] It’s the number one thing. So it’s like so many people are just overlooking, you know, some of these things. And so that’s the first thing I would say is if somebody wants to support their gut microbiome, Another idea here goes back to, I was listening to this. Lecture at Hillsdale College by this PhD in Genesis and he was saying if you’re going to be healthy You need to have a close connection to God other people in the earth Living in tune with what’s going on in nature when the sun sets when it rises those types of things And some of the research shows this one of the biggest things as an impact on our circadian rhythms is our sleep And artificial and real light.

[00:12:51] So if you wake up first thing in the morning and get outside, it’s one of the single greatest things you can do for longevity and for your gut microbiome because it starts to tell cortisol when to go up [00:13:00] and melatonin when to go down and then vice versa in the evening. That’s why you don’t want to do a lot of blue light.

[00:13:04] So you

[00:13:04] Megan: mean like sunlight in my eyes first thing in the morning. That’s

[00:13:07] Josh: right.

[00:13:08] Megan: Like I have my coffee sitting on my porch or something. Perfect. Okay.

[00:13:11] Josh: So, so good for your health. And so that’s one thing we’re seeing now in terms of studies, is that really impacts your gut microbiome hormonally, because cortisol has a really big impact on your gut and the microbes.

[00:13:21] Really?

[00:13:21] Megan: I did not know that.

[00:13:22] Josh: Yeah. In fact, hormones just do in general. So I’ll give you like not to get too off track here, but if a woman is going through their cycle, when estrogen goes up, their microbial diversity, the number of microbes go up. So estrogen acts almost like a fertilizer for more microbe growth.

[00:13:38] And so my point is that hormonal health really impacts your gut health. But going back to this, so I think that when it comes to gut microbiome health, one, just live in tune with nature. The more time you spend outside, the more microbial diversity you have. I really believe one of the single greatest things people can do is just be outside more.

[00:13:53] Yeah, it has such a big impact on our gut health. And then after that, I would say focusing on a diet [00:14:00] that is foods that are easy to digest and high in prebiotic fiber and probiotics can be helpful too. But really the diet is. A lot of wild organic meat, fruit, vegetables, ideally cooked, like soups, is even better typically than raw for most people, especially with IBD.

[00:14:17] There’s no doubt about that. And then adding in, you know, some sprouted or fermented grains can be great. Sweet potatoes, those sort of things on occasion as well. But I’d say the basis of the diet. is good quality wild protein fruit, especially things like pomegranates, figs and berries. And then, yeah, a lot of the cooked vegetables and then, and then some healthy fat.

[00:14:36] You want extra virgin olive oil, coconut oil, things like avocado, but if that’s the basis of your diet, that’s going to lead to the healthiest gut microbiome. And then from there. There’s no doubt the biggest deficiency we have is in probiotics.

[00:14:47] Megan: How do you know what probiotics to take? You know, it’s like you go to Whole Foods and one is like 50 billion, 150 billion.

[00:14:54] What do I buy?

[00:14:55] Josh: I would say there’s two things to buy, but like my philosophy is very much supplements for [00:15:00] supplementing an already healthy diet and lifestyle. So sometimes people just try and supplement their way out of things. It

[00:15:05] Michael: just won’t work. Plus that also irritates the gut. I found for me, it’s like I overtask my gut with trying to digest that stuff, those supplements.

[00:15:14] Josh: Well, the other thing that’s interesting about what you just said is every study that I’ve ever seen done on eating the whole food versus the extract. So we’ll go and buy like resveratrol from, you know, a supplement from the grape skins and it’s also in blueberries and we’ll buy that. Every study shows that you’re better off eating the blueberry.

[00:15:31] Yeah. They taste better every study. So it’s important to understand that nutrients function as a synergistically with other nutrients. And so when you have a blueberry, you’ve got resveratrol, but you’ve got anthocyanins and you’ve got fiber and you’ve got sugar and you’ve got all these things that work together.

[00:15:46] I don’t know why it’s called that way because all the drugs that you take in your body recognize it and can use it when you just do resveratrol by itself. A lot of times your body doesn’t have the other things that go with it. So just can’t use it.

[00:15:53] Megan: Michael Pollan talked about that years ago about how, you know, we don’t really understand.

[00:15:58] He’s talking about carrots and how [00:16:00] they affect, you know, vitamin A effects our eyes and how like we don’t really understand the magic of how when you eat carrots, it benefits your eye health, for example. And if you just try to extract the vitamin A all by itself, it’s not the same. Like there’s something that happens in that carrot.

[00:16:16] the way God made it. That is kind of magical. I mean, I guess we probably could understand it, but we don’t know how to recreate that as a supplement in the same way. You know, you can’t just stop eating carrots and start taking a multivitamin and call it good. I mean,

[00:16:30] Josh: from what I understand there, there are certain things in foods we haven’t even discovered yet.

[00:16:33] I mean, so yeah, you’re not getting everything. I would say, even if you are, let’s say for instance, with a probiotic, if you are, taking a probiotic supplement. I think your body will use that probiotic supplement better if you’re eating sauerkraut while taking the probiotic because even for it to grow, like that sourness that’s called acetic acid, that acid that you have in the sauerkraut that makes it sour actually creates an environment.

[00:16:56] where they can grow better in your own body. And when it comes to specific [00:17:00] strains, I would say there’s two main types of families that we’re missing. You have soil based probiotics and food based probiotics. The soil based are the ones where if you buy carrots from the farmer’s market and you kind of see, even if you wash them, there’s still kind of like little brown specks on there.

[00:17:13] Those are soil based organisms that help you break down and digest your food. And that’s probably the biggest type of probiotic we’re missing. So if somebody’s saying, I just need to take one or a single or a small amount of strains, the soil based probiotics, they’re the most resilient. They act the most like a bulldozer of getting rid of it, eliminating bad bacteria and yeast and things from your system.

[00:17:33] So that’s probably the single most important, but secondarily, then taking a probiotic that has a greater diversity of strains, I would say is typically better. And you have between probably 35 to 100 trillion bacteria just in your colon alone. And so for most people, I think they probably use higher dose than a lot of these supplements actually have.

[00:17:53] I think most people could be doing like if somebody has IBD or just took an antibiotic, I think they should probably be taking closer to [00:18:00] 1 trillion probiotics a day. Can you buy that much? Is

[00:18:03] Megan: it a dosage thing or is it like, I’m looking for that on the label?

[00:18:06] Josh: Yeah, you’ll see it on the label. So like there are brands that have their, there’s a probiotics out there that have 1 trillion.

[00:18:11] There’s maybe just one or two brands or some that have a hundred billion. That’d be the next best thing probably is a hundred billion.

[00:18:16] Michael: So I’ve suffered from digestive issues, heartburn kind of stuff. Yeah. The last several years. This is where

[00:18:24] Megan: this becomes a therapy session. That’s right. I love it. I’ve tried

[00:18:27] Michael: virtually everything.

[00:18:28] And as you know, I see functional doctors and all of them. He really

[00:18:32] Megan: has tried everything.

[00:18:33] Michael: Yeah. And so I’m still there. Now I just got an H. pylori. test that I haven’t got the results back.

[00:18:40] Josh: That’ll be really, really telling. Really? There are actually multiple causes of acid reflux. One is your stomach isn’t producing enough acid.

[00:18:47] The second is counter intuitive, right? Right. Yeah. Most people don’t think that would be the case. And the other one is your body is producing too much, which can happen. And the other thing is your digestive system. You have more SIBO. And that’s the other thing is where that [00:19:00] H. pylori bacteria creeps because really you’re most people think you’ve got bacteria all the way from your mouth to your colon.

[00:19:05] The reality is almost all of it should just be in your colon. So if it creeps up in your stomach too much like H. pylori, that’s not good. That can cause ulcers. It can cause acid reflux. That’s going to cause issues. There are multiple causes. Like I mentioned, those three that you want to pay attention with acid reflux.

[00:19:20] If you. Try apple cider vinegar before a meal about let’s say two teaspoons or a tablespoon and a little bit of water drink that and it gets better. That means your stomach is not producing enough acid. Okay. One way to help fix that is you can actually take something called HCL with pepsin. It’s hydrochloric acid.

[00:19:38] I’ve tried that. And that will help it if that’s the case. If that’s not it. Then try taking baking soda before a meal, about a fourth of a teaspoon to half a teaspoon. See how that affects you. If that’s the case, then there’s some things we need to do to kind of alkalize the pH in your stomach. And if it’s a SIBO thing, which I actually think is becoming more and more prevalent, that tends to be a stress issue [00:20:00] to where you need to just take your time.

[00:20:02] Well, eating. I mean, that means you just, there’s too much going on just throughout the day.

[00:20:06] Megan: When you say a stress thing, do you mean like my life is too stressful or like my body is under stress from the way I’m eating?

[00:20:12] Josh: Neither. It means you’re not, you never, you don’t turn it off enough. You just don’t turn what

[00:20:17] Megan: off

[00:20:17] Josh: your mind or the busyness.

[00:20:20] It’s there sometimes where you just need

[00:20:22] Megan: like anxiety margin.

[00:20:23] Josh: No, it’s not anxiety either. It’s you’re just doing stuff. 24 hours a day. Even if it’s good stuff, even if it’s, I’m going to a Bible study, I’m going to worship night. I’m going to take care of the grandkids. I’m going to this. It’s like if you have every moment of your day, kind of put this just thing from morning to night.

[00:20:39] I want you to talk

[00:20:40] Megan: about that more. Like what, how does that affect the GI system?

[00:20:46] Josh: So I did this on myself. This is

[00:20:47] Megan: so fascinating. Have you

[00:20:48] Josh: seen, you guys have seen the, the continuous blood glucose monitor? Yeah. So, so I did this and my most shocking finding of all was driving. [00:21:00] When I was driving a car, it would jump up 10 points.

[00:21:03] I mean, it would just, you know, my blood sugar would just sit higher driving a car. And that was the biggest thing that surprised me. The other thing was I could do one serving of fruit, but if I did more than a serving of fruit at a time, now if I was working out, it was totally different. I could do a lot of fruit.

[00:21:15] But if I did more than one serving of fruit, my blood sugar would just jump up. And the other thing was like I could eat certain things that like potatoes. And it was like. Didn’t affect it at all. So there were very, very surprising things there. But the biggest surprise for me was how driving and speaking, I mean, my blood sugar, it was higher when I was doing those things.

[00:21:39] Taking deep breaths and just kind of grounding, reading a book where I’m not trying to get ahead, those sort of things. It was like, you know, stayed low. So that to me was a really good real time test of saying, okay, here’s where my body is actually getting into a very. Yeah. Parasympathetic state where it can heal, where it can, you know, start to get that bacteria H.

[00:21:58] pylori back down in those, [00:22:00] yeah, rebalance.

[00:22:01] Michael: I’m interested to get these lab results back because I think that it’ll take the treatment in probably a different direction.

[00:22:06] Josh: Yeah. Cause there’s a lot you can do there. So when you have SIBO, there are certain probiotics that are better for H. pylori. There are certain types of like taking some called butyric acid is very good.

[00:22:16] So, so there, there’s a number of things when you pinpoint it, you’ll be able to. To do different.

[00:22:20] Megan: That’s so fascinating.

[00:22:28] You have a book that’s fairly new. What is it? Six months old. Yeah. Yeah. That’s called think this, not that 12 minds shifts to break through limiting beliefs and become who you’re born to be. Love that title, but talk a little bit about that connection between our bodies and our thinking. Cause I don’t think this is very intuitive for us as Westerners either.

[00:22:48] Josh: Yeah. Well, I’ll start off with this kind of because we were talking about how stuff I went through this crazy crisis almost three years ago now where I went in for a real simple medical procedure and I had [00:23:00] injured my back years ago doing CrossFit. I shouldn’t have been to, you know, it’s just anyways, that’d be a whole nother thing.

[00:23:05] I ended up hurting my back and having back pain for years and I was doing everything right. I was doing everything from physical therapy to chiropractic to nutrition. And it got better, but not all the way better. So I got turned on to stem cell therapy. I went in and got stem cell twice, but they took my own bone marrow and then reinjected it in my discs.

[00:23:25] And I got like 90 percent better. It was, it was amazing, but I just still had this little nagging thing when I flew in my back and I thought I’m going to get stem cell done one more time. And I bet it’s just a hundred percent better. Well, something didn’t go right and after I got the injection, I just kept feeling worse and worse and worse.

[00:23:39] Finally, I woke up about two months later and like, I couldn’t walk. We were in Puerto Rico at the time. I’d have an ambulance come, put me on a gurney, bring me to get an MRI, got the MRI results back. I had a spinal infection that was in my disc and my bone and an abscess in my spinal cord. I had to take a medical flight.

[00:23:55] Like you’d see in a movie, like on a gurney, put me in a plane, fly me from Puerto Rico to Florida. [00:24:00] And I met with an infectious disease doctor there and he said, Josh, this is a really serious infection. It’s spread. He said, your best case scenario is you’re going to have chronic pain the rest of your life.

[00:24:10] He said, your worst case scenario is of course this could kill you, but more likely you’re going to be permanently disabled. They’re going to have to put rods in your spine. This was two and a half years ago. And I just went from a couple of months before to throw in my two year old daughter. 10 feet in the air in the pool, swimming, cycling, deadlifting, squat.

[00:24:26] I mean, having no real issues outside a little bit of nagging pain on occasion. And I felt for 48 hours, like my life was totally over. I literally felt like, um, it was a real sort of mental, spiritual battle. And then I just spent some time in prayer and just felt like the Lord was like, listen, you’re going to be okay.

[00:24:42] Just walk with me through this. You’re going to heal. And I said, okay. And I just had a total, and I just decided that moment, I thought. I’m like, I know some of the research, like focusing on the worst possible outcome will not get me the best result. Yeah. And so I decided, okay, I’m just going to focus on what I can do in healing and just prayer.

[00:24:58] That’s, that’s all, it’s all I can do. [00:25:00] And so I came across a study on hyperbaric chambers and it cutting down antibiotic time by like 70%. I mean, for me, this is my book because I hadn’t taken a medication since high school. And I was 40 years old. And so the doctor told me, you need to be on antibiotics for three months straight to kill this infection.

[00:25:17] I’m like, well, that’s also going to just wreck my gut and immune system. But this study said you can cut down on it dramatically. So I got in a hyper, a hard hyperbaric chamber every day. This was happening while you were taking the antibiotics? Yes. Simultaneously. So I did that for a month. And then I was, I mean, I was getting IVs.

[00:25:33] I was getting methylene blue. I was getting silver ozone every day. And I was able to do this for four weeks and then stop the antibiotic and just do that. And then I just continued on with this path to healing and hyperbaric and peptides, BPC 157, TB 500. I learned so much. I mean, when it’s you or your family, I had researched everything when it comes to longevity and healing yourselves more quickly.

[00:25:55] And so I was able to get back to where now I’d say I’m probably [00:26:00] 90%. And I think I’ll be a hundred percent by the end of this year, but I didn’t walk for 10 months. And then I was on a walker for two. It took that long to heal, because your disc heals, it takes ten times longer to heal your disc than other tissues because it has no blood supply, almost.

[00:26:14] Oh my goodness. So this is why spinal injuries and disc injuries, why they take so long to heal, is they just have almost no blood supply. Wow. So

[00:26:21] Megan: how long have you been walking now?

[00:26:23] Josh: See, I would have started last month, but about a year and a half. And so it’s been a, It’s been a real journey. Do you feel

[00:26:28] Megan: like you’ve regained your strength and like muscle mass and all that?

[00:26:31] Josh: I’d say 75 percent of an 80. Like I said, I think by the end of this year, I’ll be back to a hundred percent there, but I just. That’s a long

[00:26:38] Megan: road.

[00:26:38] Josh: Yeah. It took a long time. But like I said, I mean, I learned a lot through it, but the mindset was the hardest part. The thing that actually I dealt with the most, and again, this was a, you know, real spiritual battle.

[00:26:48] I had this thing kept creeping in my head that. Well, listen, you can get 50 percent better or 70%, but you could never get a hundred or back to where you were. And it was just something I just took to God and just in prayer and just like, you know what? I, I, I’m going [00:27:00] to get back to a hundred percent. I’m going to do everything I can and just be prayerful and trusting in God in that.

[00:27:04] So for me, that was a real mindset thing. What’s crazy about writing this book is the day that I signed my thing that I’m doing this book. was the day before I got this injection. And so I wrote this entire book. There was not a day I was able to walk while I wrote the book. And when I said I couldn’t walk, I couldn’t get in a wheelchair either.

[00:27:22] After four months, I could crawl and get into a pool. But the pain was just so excruciating, I couldn’t. So this book was a real testament to mindset. That’s so fascinating.

[00:27:32] Megan: So, the ideas of this book were really battle tested. I mean, you were your own case study of somebody who had to fight, really, for your life.

[00:27:42] Yeah. Use your mind as your partner to do it.

[00:27:45] Josh: Well, one of the crazy things I came across as I was reading this book, and this was encouraging me in healing and having the right mindset, was if you look at the placebo effect, which of course we all know is such an important part of medical studies. right?

[00:27:56] Michael: Dr. Dispenza on that. Joe. Yeah.

[00:27:58] Josh: Yeah. Yeah, and he has [00:28:00] really lived in this space. He’s probably been the biggest voice in the space of really creating a placebo effect for yourself. But if you go back all the way back to when the placebo started in world war two, these were soldiers that were losing limbs and excruciating pain and they were all given the drug morphine.

[00:28:14] Well, they ran out of morphine. So the practicing physician told the nurse, he said, listen, we can’t just tell these soldiers that we have nothing. Fill these needles with saline solution, just water and salt and inject it. into them. She started doing it. The crazy part was nearly half of them experienced the same level of pain relief as if they were taking morphine.

[00:28:35] Unbelievable. The thing that I took away was your brain can create those same neuro chemicals to numb your body or heal your body that some of the most powerful drugs in the world do. So it really is amazing. And now, I mean, doctors have tried to disprove the placebo effect since then. And every time they’re blown away and the number of times it’s actually outperformed.

[00:28:57] a drug is kind of wild. And I [00:29:00] read another study where somebody was going through how to amplify the placebo effect. And here’s what he said. He said, number one, you have to visualize and know what is it you want. It really helps your nervous system being able to know. Like, so for myself, it was, I want to throw my daughter in the pool in the air.

[00:29:12] Again, I want to be cycling. I want to be squatting. I want to doing this thing. So I had to have a crystal clear picture. The next

[00:29:17] Michael: really woo woo kind of visualization is very practical.

[00:29:20] Josh: Very practical. And the other thing then they go through is they said if you tie it emotionally, your body will create more neurochemicals and hormones to help your body heal.

[00:29:29] So for instance, if I kind of put myself in that position where I’m throwing my daughter in the air and I experience that same joy and excitement and fulfillment of, Hey, I’m back where I was, that helps you heal. And the other thing they said is you really, this is all about training your nervous system and encouraging your body that this is going to happen.

[00:29:46] There’s something called neuroplasticity where your body will literally start creating new nerve pathways and repairing things for it to happen. So the other thing they said is writing down the exact plan of how this will happen. And that is more [00:30:00] convincing to your nervous system because sometimes people are like, well What was the old stewardess?

[00:30:03] I’m good enough. I’m smart enough. Gosh darn people like me. Like I’m going to heal. I’m going to heal. Like they’re like, it doesn’t work like that. You really want to create mental pictures. You want to actually feel that sense of emotion and you actually want to practically write out. This is how this is going to happen.

[00:30:16] Megan: Walk through it. Rehearse it in your mind. Is there like a dress rehearsal? I’ve had my own experience with this, not from a health perspective, but years ago, I, well, my whole life really until years ago, I struggled with a debilitating fear of public speaking. It was like my absolute worst nightmare. You know, when they say people would rather Jerry sometimes says people die, you know, then speak, they’d rather be in the coffin than giving the eulogy.

[00:30:38] That was me. I would have rather been in the coffin than giving the eulogy. And unfortunately I had a job that looked like. At some point I was going to have to speak. And so my, my team came to me at one point, I’ve been avoiding it for a long time and said, we really want you to keynote. Nobody knew this, that I had this fear.

[00:30:55] You know, it’s a secret. We really want you to keynote in front of 800 people. We have this great event, you know, [00:31:00] like the first time I’m ever going to keynote is 800 people. And so that was about six or eight weeks before it started, before the event happened, that I was going to be preparing. And one of the things that I did at the guidance of my sister, Mary, who’s a coach.

[00:31:15] I hired an anxiety coach. I hired a speech coach, did all, you know, all that kind of practical stuff. But I wrote a two or three page visualization of what it would be like to prepare and what it would be like ultimately to be on stage and give that keynote. And I wrote it by hand. I listened to it against a soundtrack from the gladiator.

[00:31:36] I said it out loud, right? Right. I, in fact, still like this very evocative for me. Like I hear that track. And I’m like, okay, I’m ready to go. Where do you want me to speak? But I really rehearsed how it would feel, how my body would feel is very physical, the language that I used. And it was a very hard six weeks.

[00:31:56] Actually, it was terrible, you know, like preparing for that. Not [00:32:00] fun, very challenging. I had a panic attack after the sound check that I did the evening before and decided to go through with it. But when I got on stage. It was awesome.

[00:32:11] Michael: She crushed it. It was so fun. It was super, it was

[00:32:14] Megan: fun. I wasn’t nervous.

[00:32:15] Everything that I had visualized happened. I really believe that it was because my body and my mind, like my whole physical person had practiced that. And I was really ready for it. Wow. And so, like, I had a totally different experience. So, you know, if you’re listening and you’re thinking, that sounds kind of woo woo, or I don’t get it.

[00:32:36] I mean, I think there’s something that’s happening, like you said, in the neuroplasticity.

[00:32:40] Josh: Yeah.

[00:32:40] Megan: That changes our brain. So it’s not the same way I had stepped on stage. That’s right. Previous to that. And

[00:32:45] Josh: there’s so much science behind this, too. Yeah. There’s so much science in how it works.

[00:32:49] Michael: Yeah.

[00:32:49] Megan: Yeah. I think that’s really an encouraging thing.

[00:32:52] Michael: When I read Dr. Dispenza’s book, You Are the Placebo. Yeah. I was so taken. Because similar to you, [00:33:00] it was a little bit different injury, but he had a, what was it? He broke his back.

[00:33:03] Josh: Yeah. That’s fine. Yeah.

[00:33:04] Michael: And they told him to never walk again. And he just laid there on the bed where he couldn’t move and visualized the outcome that he wanted.

[00:33:12] I didn’t know what I thought of that at the time. I thought it was to say this again, a little bit woo woo. But then I saw this documentary recently. I don’t know if you’ve seen the one with him where these researchers go in, highly skeptical and they track all of the people that attend this conference.

[00:33:27] And what their results were and like, they’re blown away by it. Wow. It’s crazy. And he’s, now he’s done it like several times. But clinical researchers coming in and doing all the things you would do in a clinical research project and tracking these people.

[00:33:39] Megan: Okay. One of the things I’d love for you to talk about that I think will be very relatable and applicable for our audience is in this book that is called Think This, Not That, buy it now.

[00:33:49] But, but this idea of redefining success by becoming. not accomplishing. Will you talk about that?

[00:33:56] Josh: Yeah. I had a grandfather growing up who was just an amazing [00:34:00] man. I mean, a 10 out of 10 amazing, just, you know, Christian servant heart, just amazing guy. And I was at his funeral and he lived to be 96 just amazing life.

[00:34:08] And I’m there at the funeral. And there’s a point where the pastor said, does anyone have any final words about Howard? And I had the man next to me just blurt out like Howard was my best friend. And he just started just. Weeping uncontrollably. And my first thought was, I’m a little ashamed to say this, but I thought you’re not my grandfather’s best friend.

[00:34:27] That’s my uncle Don and Ali, you know, it was like, is he really your, and there were probably 150 people there. So, but then I looked around and I thought for a second, I’m like, I’m sure my grandfather was your best friend. Cause there’s probably like half the people there that probably felt that way about him.

[00:34:39] And he was a world war two veteran in the Navy. He at 44 years old, he had worked on telephone lines like repairing telephone lines for Ohio bell. And he decided he didn’t want to do that his whole life. So they took their life savings and my grandmother and bought this pond. They dug it out, made it a bigger Lake, turned it into a campground retreat center.

[00:34:59] And he operated this [00:35:00] until literally the day he died. He was out there trying to fix things and work on it. And again, just an amazing man. And I used to go with him. He volunteered at church to go once a week to a hospital and pray with somebody and bring them their favorite meal. And so I would do that with him in the summers growing up.

[00:35:16] And it was probably the most impactful, like in terms of a. just servant heart of doing things altruistically I’ve ever been a part of. And so like I was at my grandfather’s funeral and I think I just had this epiphany there of like, what is success? Cause you know, I was writing a book and there’s a lot of an idea around building a certain size social media following, but I was just sitting there at his funeral and just thinking, wow, you know, like my grandfather impacted.

[00:35:41] So, and then, After that one guy yelled out, he was my best friend. There were people saying he led me to the Lord. He saved my marriage. I mean, people were just sharing stories of the impact my grandfather had. So that was a really eyeopening thing of me thinking about what is my biggest intention and focus on a daily basis?

[00:35:56] Is it to go and make a certain amount of money or have [00:36:00] a certain amount of followers, or is it having a certain level of impact? And one of the. Exercises I talk about in the book or things to be conscious of is not just to have a to do list, which is really important, but to have a to be list. I can, yeah, it’s like, I can go through my day and say, okay, I’m going to call Southwest airlines and.

[00:36:18] I booked this flight today. That’s one of the things on my to do list. But you know, if I break the customer service person, was that, did I win that day? So being able to say, okay, was I, was I loving, was I super compassionate today? Was I generous along with the to do list? Then you have a real impact. And so that’s part of the idea there.

[00:36:37] And, and you know, I was a triathlete in college. I was a huge Lance Armstrong fan, like one of the biggest. So when he came out as doping to me, it’s like, I felt betrayed. Yeah. A real level of betrayal. So I kind of thought about that too, as well as like, you’ve got people like that. And he had a quote in one of his books, which was essentially win at all costs.

[00:36:54] That was his whole thing. Like part of his tagline, win at all costs. There’s a lot of people that win at all costs, [00:37:00] but they never end up winning. We all hear the stories. They never truly winning.

[00:37:03] Megan: That’s so good.

[00:37:04] Michael: I want to go back to this mind thing. Again, and I want to link it back to something I know absolutely nothing about and that’s Chinese medicine or non Western medicine.

[00:37:15] So is that a big part of medicine in the East?

[00:37:18] Josh: Oh, it’s huge. In fact, in China they took a lot of different, there’s a lot of different forms of Chinese medicine, but they took one and now, now it’s called traditional Chinese medicine and it’s the main way of practicing in China and Japan has their version of it.

[00:37:31] I think it’s called Kempo and they practice it there. So if you go to Japan today. Integrative medicine has been much, much more prominent there than it has been in the United States in terms of it being. mainstream and they live an average of like seven years longer than here. It’s much longer. And so they’re Japan.

[00:37:48] If you’re going to model a healthcare system and what they’re doing, it’s a much better place to model than here. It’s practice much more prominently there. And it’s a much more mind, body, spirit approach. Like, like for instance, in Western medicine, [00:38:00] we categorize things as your liver individual organs, right?

[00:38:04] In the entire system over there in Asia, it’s systems, not. Individual organs. They never look at it as an individual organ. They look at it as your digestive system, your neuro endocrine system, your cardiovascular. Now we use those terms and we use those terms here, but it’s still much more separated in our form of medicine than it is, than it is there.

[00:38:28] Michael: Well, it seems to me like even functional doctors here, I have a limited experience with this, but I have all functional doctors. Most of them do not talk about The spiritual or the mental part of this. That’s rare. And is that because they’re so steeped in Western medicine that it just doesn’t occur to them?

[00:38:44] Josh: Yeah. And this would be going way back, but I mean, this, this happened in, I’m trying to remember if it was the eight 1700s or when it was, but basically there was a separation of church and state at the exact same time when that started happening, they started separating their science and there’s God.

[00:38:58] And God’s spiritual, mental, it’s, [00:39:00] it’s all over here. And then science is just the physical. It’s like a false

[00:39:03] Megan: dichotomy situation. Yeah.

[00:39:04] Josh: And they, we, they carry that with us. And that, that change never occurred in the East ever.

[00:39:08] Megan: Huh.

[00:39:09] Michael: That is so interesting. I wonder if that began to change a little bit. This is sort of the popularized version of it.

[00:39:15] You know, the Heisenberg principle of indeterminacy. The idea is that atoms behave differently when they’re observed. Yeah. Yeah. And so there’s this interplay. between the spiritual, mental, and the physical. And I’ve always found that fascinating, because, you know, I learned that in, when I was in school studying philosophy.

[00:39:36] And it seems like that our mind plays a much bigger role, and our spirit plays a much bigger role, than we give it

[00:39:43] Megan: And our emotions. And our

[00:39:44] Michael: emotions.

[00:39:45] Megan: Yeah.

[00:39:46] Josh: Well, I’m going to say something here as a doctor and nutritionist. And that is, I think that our mental and spiritual health is more important than our diet.

[00:39:53] I a hundred percent agree. I mean, I mean there, I created something and I’ll put this in this longevity book I’m writing, but basically it’s the cascade [00:40:00] effect of, okay, what typically happens first that starts to make you ill? And at the very, very top is it really is connected to your relationship with God, because if you believe that God is a tyrant versus if you believe he is ultimately compassionate and cares about you immensely, there’s a different level of fear that you’re going to walk around with.

[00:40:19] I mean, so there are just key emotions like fear and worry that are going to be in the depths of your soul. that are going to keep you in a fight or flight state that are going to keep organs in a defense mode. Your body works on a spectrum in terms of it being alert and trying to fight for itself or it healing.

[00:40:36] So you’ve kind of healing and growth and regeneration on one side of the spectrum and you have protection and fear on the completely other side. And so when your body is in a Protective state. This is why you can’t go and run a 5K and eat a cheeseburger. Mm-hmm. Like because your body is flying, it’s fighting.

[00:40:52] It’s actually in that protective state. Your body can’t digest and break that down. Versus if you’re relaxed, if you’re on vacation, you’ll have the best [00:41:00] digestion you’ll ever have because. Your body’s in the most calm, non protective state it can be in. So it’s, yeah. So I really believe one example of what this would look like is if you ever had anything emotionally going on, like your mind is racing where you can’t sleep when you can’t sleep, that throws off your circadian rhythms.

[00:41:15] When you’re circadian rhythms are thrown off, that disrupts your hormonal. Your melatonin, your cortisol, all of those hormones that then disrupts insulin in your pancreas, which then causes your blood sugar to go up, which is probably the biggest thing that then it causes inflammation or we call it inflammation aging now, which will cause you to age more quickly.

[00:41:33] But all of that stem from you’re living in a state of fear or worry due to your relationship with God or others. And so I think that that’s, that’s the most overlooked part of medicine is spiritual and mental, especially the spiritual wellness.

[00:41:45] Megan: You know, this reminds me of like the ACEs score that is used a lot with at risk kids, adverse childhood experiences.

[00:41:53] So it’s like the scale and you basically check off different things if you experienced as a child and [00:42:00] your ACEs score is heavily correlated with your longevity, with your health outcomes and those kinds of things. And this is relevant for me. The reason I know about this is three of my children are adopted and came from really.

[00:42:13] Um, and, um, and so there’s a lot of, you know, hard stories and what we know about kids that are adopted is they have a much higher rate of things like suicide or, you know, cancer early death from all kinds of things because the trauma has such a profound physiological impact on the body. And I don’t think we appreciate that.

[00:42:32] You know, it’s like we. We think we can just address the physiological symptoms. And I think this happens, you know, a lot of times I hear people on kind of the more holistic end of things complaining about, you know, we just like give people medicine to treat symptoms, but we also just give people holistic protocols to treat symptoms, but we don’t deal with the root.

[00:42:53] Like you’re saying emotionally, spiritually, et cetera. I had a

[00:42:56] Josh: psychologist on my podcast recently, we talked about the problem with modern [00:43:00] psychology is that she, she called it the term rumination. She said most, most professional psychologists never get to the root of your issue. Yeah. They have you talk about your problem over and over and over again.

[00:43:09] Yeah. And. In a lot of cases, yeah, exactly. It makes them worse. And so I think, I think it’s the very same thing. And you know, the field of psychology, psychiatry, even the way we think of what true mental health is or the way that we were trying to deal with it in the mainstream is not getting to the root.

[00:43:34] Megan: I think you were recently on Ian Cron’s podcast, weren’t you? Yeah. So Ian’s a good friend of ours and we had him on our show recently talking about his new book, the fix.

[00:43:43] Josh: It’s really good. Isn’t it so good.

[00:43:45] Megan: We love it. But one of the things that really stood out to me about that conversation is just how addiction is fundamentally a spiritual issue, you know, that there’s been some kind of injury or trauma that’s happened that [00:44:00] somehow has kind of gotten connected spiritually and.

[00:44:03] You’re never going to overcome addiction by just like white knuckling your willpower because it’s not fundamentally a character defect. It’s like a spiritual ache that has to be addressed. And I feel like that has so many layers of overlap with what you’re saying.

[00:44:19] Josh: There’s research on certain conditions, specifically like one’s fibromyalgia.

[00:44:22] If somebody has fibromyalgia, their chance that they were physically abused is very, very high.

[00:44:27] Megan: Yeah.

[00:44:27] Josh: Very high. Yep. There’s a lot of books on this. Again, this is a whole part of Chinese medicine that looks at this. Yeah. Gabor

[00:44:31] Megan: Monte talks a lot about that. Body

[00:44:33] Josh: keeps score. There’s all kinds of, yeah.

[00:44:35] Michael: I want to make it really practical here for our listeners.

[00:44:38] You know, we talk a lot about limiting beliefs in our work, but in your work, what do you see as the most common limiting beliefs that hold people back from better health or more success?

[00:44:48] Josh: So here’s a few that I hear just regularly. My doctor said this is irreversible. I have to be on this drug the rest of my life.

[00:44:58] It’s my genes. I [00:45:00] have the MTHFR variant or I’ve got the BRCA gene or those are probably the most common that I hear on a regular basis. And the reality is this, is that like, I’m not saying this in bragging any way, like I’ve helped tens of thousands of people reverse conditions that and so have a lot of other doctors that certain doctors would say you can’t reverse.

[00:45:20] I mean, I remember when I first got into practice, most doctors said, you cannot reverse type two diabetes. I mean, there’s still doctors that believe that that’s just not true. It’s just, I mean, there are so many people that reverse type two diabetes. The same goes for certain types of autoimmune hypothyroidism or.

[00:45:36] inflammatory bowel disease. I so this happens constantly. You know, I think what people need to do What would just one kind of mind shift is this is that don’t focus on what the majority says Focus on what the top 1 percent of the 1 percent say like when I had my back issue I went online and I thought I’m gonna be encouraged because I’m gonna read a bunch of stories about people Who had this bad of an infection and were [00:46:00] fine 100 we got back to 100 percent I was not encouraged I was really actually that made me worse And I finally met somebody who there was actually a husband and wife who were a chiropractor.

[00:46:09] They had a daughter who got a spinal infection just like I did. And they said that she got it when she was in college. They said, no, she’s back at a hundred percent. It took her three years to heal though. It took a long time. But to me, the three years was like, fine, whatever. She got back to a hundred percent.

[00:46:22] And it was the only story I’d heard of like that. But to me, it was the one thing that I clung to and said, I’m going to be that person. There’s so much information out there of influencers and other doctors. Again, there’s somebody saying keto carnivore, vegan, you know, whatever the new thing is. And it’s like, what is that person?

[00:46:40] Or the top 1 percent of 1 percent doctors and maybe people that saw the results, the type of results you want to see, just follow that person or those people or follow those top three people and where do they overlap? What are those overlapping principles? But this is true for business. It’s true for late.

[00:46:53] It’s true for anything, but people probably need to do that more in their healthcare. Cause I think it just is overwhelming if you [00:47:00] try to kind of take a few things from everybody.

[00:47:02] Michael: I had an experience where I was Having this increasing calcium score, ultimately, you know, I ended up having a heart attack and bypass surgery, but then we discovered that there was all being driven by Lp little a, which is this little sub particle of cholesterol.

[00:47:18] And unfortunately, every doctor I talked to, literally every doctor, everything I read said, there’s no way you can reverse a calcium score. There’s no way you can bring it down. If you’re lucky, even my own cardiologist at the time told me, if you’re lucky. We can stabilize it. I reduced it 35 percent over two years and I’m not done yet.

[00:47:37] And unfortunately, I can’t get a calcium score now. So we have to do some other ways to try to measure it because there’s still calcium left in the arteries. We’re taking a positive test. So anyway, but I just, I just think that’s right. But I’m not alert to all those limiting beliefs. In my own thinking.

[00:47:53] Megan: On the topic of longevity, you know, our audience tends to be people that are like our age and older, [00:48:00] you know, like we certainly have outliers, but there are people that are thinking of being outlier

[00:48:03] Michael: here.

[00:48:04] Megan: No, you’re probably not an outlier. Actually. I just mean like, there’s probably younger people that are a little bit on the outlier, you know, in their twenties and thirties, but.

[00:48:11] For people who are high achievers, they, you know, they care about their health. They’re probably not doing as much as they wish they were, but they want to live a long time and they want to live healthy a long time, more importantly. What are like the top three or four things that people should prioritize?

[00:48:26] Cause you, what you just said about overwhelm is so right. I mean, you know, if you read all the articles and all the books, you could make it your full time job to take care of your health, which is not practical for anybody. So where are we going to get like 80 percent of our results from that 20%?

[00:48:40] Josh: Yeah.

[00:48:41] Well, let’s break it down into spiritual, mental and physical, physical. I have a, I have a couple of things, but, and by the way, one other thing, I am shocked at the number of people in their thirties that are focusing on longevity. Yeah. Yeah. There’s a lot of millennials that are really focused on it too now.

[00:48:54] And I’m not talking about just the lip fillers and that sort of thing. So, um, [00:49:00] so spiritually, I think that. There is something that I did. I started doing this in college and it has had such a positive impact on me in the morning. I do a spiritual triathlon and you can do it for just 15 minutes, but I spend a few minutes just saying what I’m grateful for.

[00:49:13] And just as a prayer, God, I’m so grateful for my family, for my amazing wife, for my girls that have the opportunity to do what I love. And I think about, Hey, just some things going on relevant right now. So I do that. And then I spend a few minutes reading my Bible or a book about the book, you know, and then I’ll spend a few minutes just praying and just connecting with God, listening for a few.

[00:49:33] But when I do that, my entire day is different. I mean, it’s just radically different. Just being able to just have that spiritual grounding first thing in the morning. So that’s the first thing. The second thing would be right down. The five people you spend the most time with now in grade them on scale of one to 10 on how much they, where they’re at in terms of iron sharpens iron and just nourishing you in a good way, healthy way.

[00:49:57] And then write down where you’re at. Cause be real with yourself too. You want to [00:50:00] be growing in that area too. I think this goes back to that Harvard longevity study in terms of like, who’s your community, who are you spending time with? We’ve all heard this, Michael, you said it before I said it. And somebody said it before you said, it’s like you become like the five people you spend the most time with that general principle, the five, seven, 10, whatever it is.

[00:50:15] That’s true. So you really want to make sure you’re spending time around virtuous people that are iron sharpens iron. And then the next thing, when it comes to the physical, I would say diet is really important. Remember this though, just because one diet worked for your buddy or your best friend doesn’t mean that same data work for you.

[00:50:33] For most people, the best longevity diet is going to be a diet that you really focused on three to four main food groups. Number one, the meat is organic and wild, wild salmon, grass fed beef, pastured chicken. The next is vegetables. If you have autoimmune disease, if you have a digestive system, that’s not real strong, your body temperature is lower like hypothyroid.

[00:50:54] You want to do almost all cooked vegetables. You can do some raw in summer if it’s really hot out, but you generally [00:51:00] want to do more cooked as in soups. You could steam them, but you want to focus on vegetables and then do fruits. The fruits that will get you the biggest bang for your buck, number one’s probably pomegranates.

[00:51:09] After that, it’s probably berries. And there are others. Apples and figs are great too, especially for moving your gut if you have gut health issues. But those three things, meat, fruit, and vegetables, meat, fruit and vegetables will have the biggest impact on you. And then throwing in your oils, the extra virgin olive oil is number one, followed by coconut oil.

[00:51:26] Number two, for most people are going to have the most therapeutic benefits. So I would say that’s the diet and then movement. Not everybody has to go and lift weights, but. You need to walk as much as you possibly can and just spending time walking outside. So just schedule like, and especially if you can do it first thing in the morning for 20 minutes, getting outside, getting that sunlight, kind of getting your cortisol, melatonin, those hormones where they need to be is ideal.

[00:51:50] So I think if people can do those things, it’s really

[00:51:53] Megan: like doable. And by the way, fun hack on the walking, this has been my favorite thing is that I try most [00:52:00] days to do one meeting on the phone while I’m walking. So I’ll just go walk. And it’s like, you don’t even know you’re doing it. Now, am I getting my heart rate very high?

[00:52:08] No, but Hey, I’m moving. And you know, a lot of days I’ll, I’ll take a walk, walk, you know, for exercise in the morning. You don’t actually have to do everything on zoom.

[00:52:17] Michael: You can

[00:52:18] Megan: just get, get on the phone. Like it’s 1996 again, you know, it’s great.

[00:52:21] Michael: I want to ask about one that it seems like you omitted. And that’s sleep.

[00:52:27] Josh: Is the quality of your sleep? It could be number one on the whole list. It, it just, and here’s what I would say to get good sleep. Again, remember, natural light as much as you can throughout the day. After dinner, just do as minimal artificial light as possible. Put on the blue blocker sunglasses, those orange shades, makes a big difference.

[00:52:43] And then, if you’re going to watch a show, try and watch it right after dinner. Now, ideally go on a walk right after dinner. But then after that, yeah, watch your show for an hour or so. But before you get into bed, I mean, at least 30 minutes, ideally an hour. Don’t be on a device. You’re much better listening to an audio book or reading a [00:53:00] book than you are Using any sort of screen.

[00:53:03] I need to hear this. Yeah, and yeah So and and again doesn’t mean you can’t watch your show or whatever it is But just right before bed and then a few things that also help the studies show The colder, the better almost when it comes to your room, ideally between 60 and 65 degrees.

[00:53:18] Megan: Ooh, that’s even colder than I know.

[00:53:20] All the women my age and older are like, amen, baby. Yes.

[00:53:24] Josh: Heavy weighted buying a weighted blanket

[00:53:26] Megan: is

[00:53:26] Josh: helpful. And then you want your room to be pitch black. I mean, you want to be able to see zero light in there. But no, sleep is huge because it’s when your body regenerates. And one amazing thing is, is I was kind of studying my own ability to heal.

[00:53:39] It was 70 percent of your body is new every seven years. So your tissues are continually regenerating and healing. Most of us are not getting enough sleep. And don’t have the right building blocks in terms of nutrition in order for us to fully regenerate the tissues. Wow. But sleep is the biggest part of it.

[00:53:56] So good. Yeah.

[00:53:57] Megan: Amazing. Okay. So on our show, we have [00:54:00] kind of a lightning round of three questions that we ask every guest. Are you ready? Yeah. Okay. So the first question is, what is your biggest obstacle right now in getting the double win, winning at work and succeeding at life?

[00:54:11] Josh: Oh, goodness. I think just having little kids and I mentioned this little kids getting sick.

[00:54:16] Like we, you know, a couple of weeks ago, one had the flu. The other had the flu. Then I got it, which by the way, I didn’t have the flu since I was eight years old

[00:54:23] Megan: or something different going on right now. I don’t know what the deal is. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:54:26] Josh: So I think before I had kids, I felt like Every day was the same, like in terms of my schedule.

[00:54:30] I mean, I was like, you know, wake up at six, do this, do this, do this. Sometimes they just throw a wrench in my whole thing. So that’s my biggest challenge for sure.

[00:54:39] Megan: Yeah. I’m right there with you. It’s so, it’s so challenging.

[00:54:43] Michael: Okay. Second question. How do you personally know when you’re getting the double?

[00:54:47] When

[00:54:48] Josh: I have a great relationship with my wife, you know, when I feel like Chelsea and I are on the same page, we’re on the same team, we’re high fiving, you know, that sort of feeling. I think that that’s when I know, [00:55:00] cause there’s, there’s an element too of when I’m really connected with God, I’m also serving Chelsea better and I’m a better husband and I’m a better dad.

[00:55:07] And I think there’s a little bit more of a serenity of a greater level of patience as well too. And for me, it’s like, if I can be patient, My reactions are, because I mentioned this before, like I’m an eight Enneagram. I just want to run right into things. If I can be in a state of just patient for just, and I’m talking about, this is just a few seconds longer than normal, then I feel like I’m a better dad and husband.

[00:55:27] And so for me, I think if Chelsea and I feel a sense of connection, I know I’m winning. Great answer.

[00:55:33] Megan: That’s awesome. Okay. What’s one ritual or routine that you rely on to do what you do?

[00:55:39] Josh: Oh, goodness. I mean, for me, it’s exercise. So like my mornings, I try and again, I try and make them as consistent and they are pretty consistent most days.

[00:55:47] And so I tend to wake up in the morning, do my spiritual triathlon. Then I do a superfood smoothie. It tends to have like a bone broth powder, a plant protein. So I’m getting like 40 to 50 grams of protein in the morning. I’m doing some berries in there or some [00:56:00] sort of fruit typically. And then I, um, Connecting with the family for a few before the girls go to school.

[00:56:06] And then I go do my workout and then start my day. But like for me, like I’m very, if I, it’s that when the morning, when the day, I spend time with God, connect with the family, get my workout in good breakfast. Um,

[00:56:19] Megan: what do you do for exercise?

[00:56:21] Josh: I probably do weight training four days a week. I do probably an interval cardio.

[00:56:26] I do Peloton. I probably do that two days a week. And outside of that, I probably do something else like pickleball a day a week. And that’s kind of my, my, my routine. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:56:36] Michael: That’s great. Well, Josh. Thank you so much for being on the show. This has been a fascinating interview. And I feel like we say this almost every week, but this just was a natural conversation where we were really curious about what you had to say.

[00:56:49] And we feel like we’ve really learned from you and hopefully our audience has as well. So thanks. Awesome. Thanks for having me.

[00:56:54] Megan: Okay.[00:57:00]

[00:57:05] Michael: Let’s talk about that interview. Now I just said to you before we started recording this follow up, man, I just feel like we’re saying that was such a great interview. And you said,

[00:57:15] Megan: and I said, what are you going to stop saying? Like that was a great meal. Every time you go to a great restaurant, no, you’re going to be excited every time.

[00:57:22] And we were, it was so fun. Okay. It

[00:57:24] Michael: was a five out of five. We love talking about health. And of course. Mind, body and spirit are three of the life domains that we talk about. And we just addressed three of them, but particularly one of them with relationship to the body.

[00:57:39] Josh: Yeah.

[00:57:40] Michael: But really all of them together.

[00:57:41] And there’s, there are a few people that really have a kind of a comprehensive understanding of the interplay between those three.

[00:57:47] Megan: Mm hmm. Well, I really appreciated. That Josh focused on the non physical parts of things that contribute to your physical health because I have heard so many times, both from traditional [00:58:00] doctors, from more kind of integrative holistic doctors, just so much guidance around what to do with your body with an almost complete disregard.

[00:58:10] For the rest of your person, you know, your emotional well being your mental health your spiritual health And I think that that is at a cost

[00:58:22] Michael: I think so too and you and I both seek out integrative medicine Practitioners functional health doctors, you know, we believe in all that but what that really means I think for most functional health doctors Is that they’re trying to integrate all the various systems of the body

[00:58:37] Megan: or that they’re trying to move away from pharmaceuticals more to the point.

[00:58:41] Michael: Yes. And

[00:58:41] Megan: that’s kind of reductionist in a way. Like it’s, it’s ironically, not holistic enough.

[00:58:46] Michael: Kind of is true.

[00:58:47] Megan: Yeah.

[00:58:47] Michael: But I think when you take into account both body, mind and spirit, that’s the trifecta that you really want to organize around. And so he does that. And I love it. In fact, I just thought of a title for his next book.[00:59:00]

[00:59:00] Megan: Oh. He

[00:59:00] Michael: had to do a book called The Spiritual Side of Being Healthy.

[00:59:04] Megan: Ooh.

[00:59:04] Michael: Or The Mental Side of Being Healthy.

[00:59:06] Megan: Yeah, great. Okay, Josh, we’ll get back to you on that. Yeah,

[00:59:08] Michael: we’ll get back to you on that.

[00:59:10] Megan: Um, okay, so what were some of your biggest takeaways outside of that?

[00:59:14] Michael: You know, because I do a lot of research in this, I mean, I hate to say this, but I’m not easily impressed, but I was really impressed By the, the breadth of Josh’s understanding of medicine and I also like his commitment to simplicity.

[00:59:27] Megan: Yeah. Not a lot of people are good at that.

[00:59:30] Michael: No. And I think a lot of the practitioners, providers that I’ve been to, you know, they’re, they’re kind of, their philosophy is, is if a little bit is good, then more is better. And so I was literally at one point. This is really embarrassing to admit, but I was doing like 80 supplements a day.

[00:59:47] Megan: I kind of want to throw up just thinking about it.

[00:59:49] Michael: Yeah. There’s, there’s a lot of problems with doing that much stuff, but I love the fact that he said that supplementation is always second best to getting the right food.

[00:59:58] Megan: Well, and even his [01:00:00] explanation of what the right food is, is very simple. And very simple.

[01:00:04] I don’t know about you guys, but I regularly just feel overwhelmed by all the stuff. You know, when you think about just the decision fatigue of trying to take care of your health. And if you broaden that to include your mental health and your emotional health and your spiritual health, like it’s like a full time job and none of us have time for another full time job.

[01:00:26] And so I appreciated that he kept it really simple and really basic because it feels like almost anybody could do those things. Almost anybody could. Focus on eating and with regard to eating high quality protein and more fruits and vegetables. It’s like not about what you’re taking away. It’s really about what you’re putting in.

[01:00:45] Like just add more of this stuff and crowd out the other stuff that just feels like, cool, I can do that. Well, you know, and I love that.

[01:00:52] Michael: And I can testify as somebody who’s been on the Mediterranean diet now for several years that it’s really enjoyable.

[01:00:58] Megan: Yeah.

[01:00:59] Michael: It’s good [01:01:00] stuff. It’s not like you’re going to consign yourself to some kind of ascetical practice where you’re only going to eat.

[01:01:07] This one thing.

[01:01:08] Megan: Well, the people that live in the Mediterranean seem to be pretty happy, so they’re not missing out too much. You know?

[01:01:15] Michael: I also found his story fascinating about that infection he got in his spine and how he had to work. And he was very transparent about that, but how he had to work to overcome those limiting beliefs in his own mind.

[01:01:26] Like he’s never going to get better or he’s going to only get 70 percent better or whatever. And I’ve certainly, you know, in the various health challenges I faced over the years. You know, I found myself thinking some of those things. Sure.

[01:01:36] Megan: Absolutely. Well, I felt like it was hopeful. It was exciting to hear about things that are newly available.

[01:01:45] You know, he was telling us about the kind of cellular medicine clinic that he’s going to be opening in September and middle Tennessee, and it happens to be very close to where we live. And so we’re just like, take all our money, you know, and [01:02:00] I think it’s because a lot of times these optimizing our health.

[01:02:05] Are in all these different places everywhere, and it’s just very inconvenient and requires a lot of coordination. And so the idea of bringing it all together in one place sounds really awesome, you know, just simplifying things. And I hope that that more and more becomes. that we have to do less leg work.

[01:02:19] To find the things that are helpful. You know, but it isn’t housed under one. Roof. I think

[01:02:23] Michael: it will because I think there’s a big financial opportunity there. Yeah. And I think physicians are getting the vision for it. other healthcare providers, this is going to be good going forward.

[01:02:30] Megan: Also, the gut microbiome, that was my favorite part.

[01:02:33] I almost forgot. Oh, I know. The reason that that was my favorite part is I just feel so perplexed by that. You know, I’ve done a lot of research in that area. You want your head to just spin and feel like your brain’s in gymnastics. That’s a great way to get it there. And you just made it so simple.

[01:02:48] Michael: Well, and I’ve been really challenged by this and really struggling with this for a couple of years now.

[01:02:53] And I feel like I’m on the cusp of a breakthrough.

[01:02:55] Megan: Yeah. And

[01:02:55] Michael: by the way, if you can think of a gut solution for me, [01:03:00] don’t send it to me. Okay. Because I literally, I think I’ve tried everything, but I’m working with several good practitioners. And I think we’re on the cusp of a breakthrough.

[01:03:09] Megan: Well, all this to say what a great episode.

[01:03:11] We learned a lot. We got excited about a lot. It was awesome.

[01:03:15] Michael: It was awesome. Thanks for joining us. If we could ask a favor, if you would rate the show and consider writing a review, that would be enormously helpful to us in getting the message of the double win out. It does raise the show in the rankings where people can discover it.

[01:03:33] And we’re on a mission. We’re on a mission to help people get the double win, which is winning at work and succeeding at life, which is why we spend. A lot of time, not only on the work topics, but on the non work topics. So make it a great [01:04:00] week.